NetNews Offline 2/NetNews Offline Volume 2.iso/news/comp/sys/amiga/misc-part1/3804

Internet Message Format | 1996-08-05 | 10.1 KB

Path: zetnet.co.uk!demon!hchworth.demon.co.uk
From: Paul Chan <paul>
Newsgroups: comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: The March Amiga?
Date: Thu, 01 Feb 1996 11:24:10 GMT
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[e-mail] (George Noel) wrote:

[snips]

>They are new to handling the Amiga, overseas (their homeground) is their
>testing ground to work out all the problems before attempting to move
>into North America full force.  This also gives them a chance to gain
>capital moreso then they would get in North America right now.

At the expense of European users who are charged exorbitant prices? I would
hope that AT are ignoring the A1200 for NA and go with the A1200Plus instead. I
know I`m not in the US to comment on this, but that`s what I would do.

Still no excuse to keep hammering us Euros though. Sales will soon start to
tell our tale to AT, that`s for sure.

[snips]


>...Sometimes a new change is needed and so
>far it is working ok, this company responsible for the OS coding might
>bring us some nice surprises in the future.

I hope they do.



>Escom have done studies in Europe etc. about what name people associate
>things with the best.  They did this with their PCs and found out Commodore
>was the second most known to IBM (or whathaveyou) thus one of their reasons
>for the buying of Commodore to get the name and the logo to help sales.
>They then did another study and found out "Golf" is widely recognized in
>Europe thus in their press releases stated this is why they decided to name
>some of their computers Commodore Golf.  In North America, their is a German
>car imported called the Volkswagon Golf also.. the sport Golf is widely
>popular in North America, especially the US.  You should already know
>names sell. Right now the word constantly being associated with the net is
>surfing yet no piece of software or computer is named after it.. until now.

It seems a little basic, but I`ve been throwing out ideas of my own, including
internet packages, and radical case designs. AT seem to be talking name badges
for the thick. Maybe it seems a little condescending to us - I`m only
interested in price/spec ratios - and maybe features/image.

OK, maybe AT`s advertising direction is a little embarrassing, but as long as
they do OK by us experienced users, I won`t complain. The problem is, they
aren`t doing well in their current price policy at the moment...


>>No, it's an example of how much imagination AT "marketing" has:  none.
>
>See my above paragraph.  For some reason a computer that can access the net
>and web nowadays cannot be looked at as a toy as it is the in thing and is
>hip to do, if people can do it cheaper then more power to them.  The only
>problem facing them is the underpowered category and if possible, they
>should release an A1200+ Surfer kit in the future if the set-top box doesn't
>take over that market for them.

The only thing is that the A1200 looks like a toy, and in some ways, is powered
like a toy... :(

If only AT would look to some innovation in case design...

>>GP> >GP> See, made my point. We WILL wait a year. They are/should be chasing
>>GP> new, >GP> entry level buyers who will expand into that new PPC later on.
>
>I also agree, the lowend market now and in the near future will be a great
>start to migrate to the PPC Amiga 1 or 2 years down the road (assuming not
>everyone will be able to afford to run out and get one right away).

It depends on the machine they are using to base their "great expansion" on. An
A1200 woud be badly constricted by the slow gfx. This demands that the
A1200Plus at least have a gfx expansion capability to keep up with even average
SVGA cards in terms of serious apps.


>How can YOU tell if no new buyers have bought one?

Low sales figures, zero advertising, limited distribution, demand pent up by
existing Amiga users only. What does that equal then?

I`d say it was a resurgence of a few Amigan upgraders looking to buy an A1200,
maybe with the software as an incentive to upgrade from their A500/A600. This
is what I believe to be the situation in the UK, anyway.

>
>>GP> And if there are 'some' new buyers, where did they hear about the
>>GP> Amiga?
>>
>>Word of mouth from Amiga owners, since they haven't put in any
>
>Exactly and sometimes this is good and right now AT has to concentrate on
>otherthings moreso then advertising.  Granted it IS needed when the Surfer
>package hits the shelves and for the Power Amiga, if they or any possible
>partners they could have do not advertise from the Surfer on up, THEN you
>can start labelling them as Commodore all over again.

We wait with a heavy heart for the March relaunch and what AT do with it... :(
I hate to knock AT, but if it`s necessary, I will...

>Let's put it this way, they don't have to do ANYTHING with the Amiga if
>they didn't want to.. then how much will the dissatisfaction rate go up?
>Be lucky they are doing anything at all and NO company can work miracles
>overnight.  I like seeing you voicing your concerns but I think you and
>the others are taking it too far, if you have that PC blood in you, you
>should choose that path and leave the Amiga to Amigans.

So, we should be glad that they are doing anything with the Amiga at all?
What is an Amigan in your eyes then? Another yes-lap-dog, ready to praise
anything that AT come up with? If that is so, then a lot of people who own
Amigas can`t really be called Amigans. For the Europeans, how many of use
winced when we saw the price of the A1200? We didn`t applaud it on price,
that`s for sure. I`m also sure that AT will come up with questionable moves
concerning the Amiga in the future. And I`m sure Dr K is reading this
discussion, cutting out the bull (a lot of it, I`m sure) and taking the good
advice into consideration.


>
>>Let's see, they drained, by YOUR OWN ESTIMATE, US$85 million over
>>calendar year 1995.  Did AT pull in US$85 million in sales in calendar
>>1995?  Debits are greater than credits; to me, that means a loss.  Yes,
>
>Sometimes you have to lose money in order to make it.  If AT is still
>losing money when the Power Amiga is introduced and a mass-marketing
>campaign is in place, then you can start to worry.  Not to put words in
>Dr. P. K's mouth but under frsutration here in one post he said under the
>worst conditions we are guranteed one new generation of the Amiga.
>In my opinion, after that, the sales and support for the Power Amiga will
>determine if the lowend and mid-ranged PPC Amigas will be built (more then
>likely they will as they would sell more) and then if things didn't look
>good, no more Amiga advances and they could stick to being PPCP box movers.

<sarcasm mode on>
So, AT are losing money by pricing their European Amigas so cheaply that they
are leaping out the shops and into the hands of new users, who, attracted by
the high specification and excellent advertising, are abandoning the charms of
the PCs in the same store? I couldn`t get an A1200 if I wanted to, even though
every computer/tv/electrical shop on the high street was sold out?
<sorry about that>

To gain popularity quickly, AT must release a mid-range PPC machine as well as
the top end one. Otherwise, software won`t really take off.

>
>>And I'm the walking ugly stick for AT.  Just playing devil's advocate,
>>Gary m'dear.  It's my job to ask the tough questions and make the
>>points others don't want to see, like yourself.  See, I've got you in a
>
>Who says he or anyone else doesn't want to hear the stuff?  I think anyways
>going about it the way you are is hurting moreso then helping.

And what view are you taking? I`d bet if it was possible, you`d cancel our
postings because they`d unduly depresss the AT bunch, and the neutral Amigans
on the list - and replace them with your antiseptic goody-goody edited
propaganda about how excellent the Amiga is, what a bargain it is, and buy one
now. ;)

You`d probably watch the ship go down too, from the safe haven of your brand
new spanking A1200.


>I still cannot see how you have to worry yourself over the A1200 or A1200+
>with the machine you currently have and the goals you have for the future
>other then you don't like the supposed image the public will associate
>the AMIGA with based on these lowend computers.. am I right?  Other then
>that you are talking to a totally different part of the population and AT
>needs to be well rounded in order to survive.

I`m bothered about the public image of the Amiga. In the UK it has been
prevalently negative: A dead underpowered games machine.

Now it`s an overpriced, underpowered, ageing games machine that doesn`t cut the
salt anymore because the Playstation is CHEAPER!

The tech spec of the Amiga AGA has been the millstone for a good few years now.
The non-existent advertsing has not helped, and now the exhorbitant price on
top has driven customers away from AT`s projected sales target.

Quite simply, the PPC had better hurry up, and had better be earth shatteringly
good too (and cheap), well built, intelligently advertised, decent software.
IMHO, that`s my definition of well rounded. Anything less is just another
excuse for the neutral to buy a PC/Playstation/Mac/Saturn.

>
>>about AT, I'm staying loyal.  I feel that this computer transcends the
>>owners of the OS.  Remember, Gary, AT does not equal Amiga.
>
>No, but there are still a lot of people inside AT that have had a lot to
>do with the Amiga for years and AT can make or break the Amiga.  If you
>have a problem with AT, do not take it out on the computers.

It`s not the A1200`s fault for being outdated, I would have accepted anAmiga
A1200 in the market place had it been half the price. That`s all it`s worth in
the midst of PCs and superconsoles, I fear.

>>they think that bringing in the PPC cold will do it for NA.  A
>>preemptive marketing campaign for the PPC once the release date is
>>definite is mandatory.
>
>Give them a chance!

To do what? Mess up the chances for PPC mass acceptance?